Help with chocolate setting (Bittersweet) (PICS)
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Awesome! Thanks so much for the welcome!
Forum Activity for @Erica Rodriguez-Anthony
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Help with chocolate setting (Bittersweet) (PICS)
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It's all about producing the correct type of crystals in the cocoa butter so that when it cools the crystals form a nice lattice that contracts. This give chocolate with gloss, snap, the expected mouth feel and resistance to melting at room temperature.
Help with chocolate setting (Bittersweet) (PICS)
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Really that's it? I just have to run it thru the tempering machine and temper it? Great! Yeah! Thanks - will try it tonight! It seems so unreasonable how just altering the temperature can completely change the feel and consistency, without acutally changing/adding anything to the material (chocolate) Thanks!
Help with chocolate setting (Bittersweet) (PICS)
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Yup - tempering is the solution to your problem.
And welcome to the forums Erica.
Help with chocolate setting (Bittersweet) (PICS)
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Hi! My name is Erica, I live in FL and I'm happy to be here! This is my First Post and I have a problem/question....I usually use Merckens Candy coating when making my chocolate, but now am experimenting with real chocolate since I now have the Revolation 2 tempering machine (as of this AM!) IM SOOOOO EXCITED. However heres my question, when I use bittersweet chocolate, it seems that it never sets. Now, I am not tempering it, I'm melting the baking chips down in the microwave in small incriments and then dipping my pretzels, oreos, etc, but b/c this chocolate (bittersweet) literally melts in your hand its not ideal for anything I'm creating. How do you transform bittersweet chocolate so that it will actually set and have the "snap" that is ideal? Will tempering help at all? Thanks in advance! Erica
updated by @Erica Rodriguez-Anthony: 04/13/15 06:29:20
Stuffed nose when Cracking and Winnowing
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Brian,
Thank you so much for your kind and informative reply.It seems the best job in the world does have its hazards.The mask types are a great reference!
On second thought, I might as welllook for a Darth Vader mask and outfit.
Felipe
Stuffed nose when Cracking and Winnowing
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Hi Felipe, without knowing what kind of beans or equipment you are using, I would say that you are guessing correctly. Cacao dust is a big problem for us when we are bagging for export for example, its a strong eye/respiratory irritant. that same dust is present in roasting and winnowing. in chocolate processing you also have acetic acid laden vapor, ash particles, and your respiratory tissues are dried out from the heat potentially, which makes all problems worse. Grinding and conching liberates a lot of vinegar (acetic) acid which is very hard on the respiratory system.
If the mask helps then I would say you need a better mask or a filtered breathing system. try an N95 rated medical mask for example which should mold around the nose, seals off better than a simple exam mask, and protects against finer particles. or go to a 1 or 2 cartridge respirator, using cartridges rated for fine particulate and/or acid vapors. they're not fun to wear but they do protect you.
hope this helps
brian
Stuffed nose when Cracking and Winnowing
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I have noticed that in days of intense indoor chocolate making work I end up with some discomfort. Commonly a stuffed or a runny nose, similar to having a cold.
My first guess is the smaller particles that are liberated when grinding the beans and winnowing may get into one's respiratory system and produce this symptoms. I tried wearing a mask while grinding and winnowing (both indoors) and it seems to help, but not completely.
How about vapors while roasting? Is the acid from the strong whiffing to tell if beans are done doing something nasty to my nostrils?
Does anyone care to share what kind of measures are being used by them or their teams?
updated by @Felipe Jaramillo F.: 04/11/25 09:27:36
Chocolates in India
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we mould a lot of compound chocolates, almost 1500 kg per month. please contact for your specific requirements. my contact details are +919537125212 chintan shah, vadodara, gujarat, india
Chocolates in India
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Did you get my mail?
If you haven't received it, please send me a test mail on akaliwala@gmail.com
Chocolates in India
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Just sent you an email. Please check and revert.
Akbar Kaliwala.
Chocolates in India
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Looking to find a partner to expand India's chocolate consciousness, growing, manufacturing, supplying etc.Big challenge! Anyone interested email me cliveeta@yahoo.comAm in Delhi now, will travel if neccessary, cheers Clive
updated by @Clive Brown: 04/15/15 22:41:33
What is the best way to decorate with Gold Leaf?
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I use small paintbrushes. You can pick up a bit of gold leaf on the brush and dab it on. I think it works reasonably well although I still think gold leaf can be hard to control! Andrea
What is the best way to decorate with Gold Leaf?
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I like to decorate my enrobed bon bons with gold leaf; however, I find that I have a hard time controlling it. I have tried using a pairing knife as well as tweezers. It works, but it certainly does not work 100 percent of the time. I use the sheets and it can sometimes lead to a mess. Has anyone ever tried the petals? I would love to get some tips on how to handle this delicate product. Thanks!
updated by @Daniel Herskovic: 04/11/25 09:27:36
Aargh cracking shell
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They are not refrigerated and the room temperate is 71 degrees
Aargh cracking shell
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So every so often a batch of truffles will crack after dipping and hardeningI do a very thin coat by hand before dipping. Most pf my truffles are pretty thick in consistency(low moisture)What could be going wrong? So frustrated!
updated by @Krista2: 04/11/25 09:27:36
melanger necessary?
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Hey Clay - curious to see - you mentioned before that you were working on a 40KG South Am universal? Any progress on that? Would you be willing to share contact details. Located in South America so maybe I could help.
I am working with a company out of South America to bring a 40kg universal to the US for well under $10k - probably not until September at the earliest.
melanger necessary?
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Beth and Clay,I have used my Premier Wonder grinder to make some decent chocolate and have successfully had the machine run for 48-72+ hours (depending on batch size, I run until I am happy with texture/particle size, then release pressure on wheels and "conche" until happy with volatile acidity/aroma/flavor) for more than 10 batches. I have made up to 6.5lb batches in the Premier. I also have a Santha 40 melangeur. I am happy with both, although have had to replace the belt on the Santha and I think the Premier may be starting to slip (main nylon central "shaft" slipping in base locking ring).Regards,Tim
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Hi there Clay, I am wondering if you have gotten the 40 kg universal from South America yet and if so, how can I find out more about it? Also do you know of any other brands that have them under $10k. I have asked Brooklyn Cacao for a quote on theirs but I am not too optimistic that I will be able to afford it. thanks, beth
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Also Beth,
What have you used for tempering? What are your thoughts?
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Beth,
Yes! I am all ears. I am happy to learn anything that will help me save time, learning and money along the way. I am going to the Specta Page now.
I have come across a lot of you posts on chocolate life over the last few months. I have been making "raw" chocolate, which I dont even know what to think of now. Its a long road to mastery 
Ive appreciated your posts. I feel like they have been directed to the areas of learning that I am trying to uncover. Any insight you would like to share is absolutely welcome.
Jess
melanger necessary?
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Hi there Jessica,
just wanted to let you know about another option for melangers than cocoatown. I am not happy with that machine and am about to reinvest in a Spectra, which also offers more affordable larger capacity machines, which I need at this point. Check them out at chocolatealchemy.com
I have not used them yet, but in talking with him I am more clear about the weak points in the cocoatown machine and that I can get an all stainless steel center, which hopefully would last alot longer. If you use any alternative sugars, I would be careful to only add a little sugar at a time. I do use a vitamix to pregrind the sugar and I am learning through my mistakes what not to do with the melanger. i am happy to share them with you to save you $ lost. Beth
melanger necessary?
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In the sense that you would use it for pre-grinding, refining, and conching - yes. It's is very small, though, and I wonder if it would be able to be run for 24-72 hours at a stretch, which is what it can take to convert nib and sugar into finished chocolate.
melanger necessary?
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Beth,
I am just getting started. Im not sure that I can offer much. I am currently in the market for a tempering machine and cocoatown melanger.
Until this point, I have made chocolate by letting the cacao powder, butter, sugar and other ingredients sit and warm together for a half hour or so. Then I put them in my Vitamix, then temper. Its not the smoothest, but the Vitamix does help. I am hoping that the Melanger will create a better consistency. But it sounds like you are having issues with the Melanger?
My suggestion would be to put the sugar through a Vitamix. They have a special canister to turn grain into flour, which might be effective with the sugar. Its an investment, but you can buy refurbished models online that are discounted and still come with warranty. Or maybe a Champion Juicer? Or pre-grinder?
Jessica
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are you grinding in the sugar and if so what machine do you use? I am struggling with my cocoatown melanger and it can't seem to keep up with my small batches of 10 lbs. I am trying to figure out what to invest in and don't have many other people to discuss the use of that sugar and get the equipment I need.
updated by @beth campbell: 09/07/15 17:17:56
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I am using a reuseable metal canister type with indicator silica gel. I am actually trying to reorder them but I am having trouble finding where I previously ordered from. If i figure it out I'll let you know.
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Beth,
What dessicant cans have you found to be effective?
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Clay would the premier wonder Grinder be considered a universal?
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$500, and I am finding it is wearing out quickly, not sure if I am causing that or it is because of the nylon washer they use. I am finding they are wearing quickly.
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Hi Beth,
if you don't mind me asking the price you paid for the cocoatown melanger?
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Beth:
Taste the liquor. What's the texture? How much acidity is in it? That will tell you if the liquor has been conched at all - or just refined. There's no standard procedure for this, but I would guess that most liquors are not conched though they may be ground finely enough so that the texture is okay ... but not all are.
Both sugar and cocoa butter tend to grab on to aromas - good ones and bad ones - making it harder to drive them off. A general strategy would be to work with just the liquor for several hours before adding any other ingredients (e.g., sugar) and then grind/refine/conche until you get the flavor you want and then add the cocoa butter.
Question - commercial powdered sugar or sugar you are powdering yourself? Most commercial powdered sugar has cornstarch in it and you don't want that in your chocolate bar.
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thanks so much for all you share Clay. It is very informative and I get alot out of this website. I look forward to hearing more about this machine. As my business grows I would love to upgrade to a larger capacity, quicker method. I have sooo much more to learn about making chocolate, but seem to be making many people happy in the meantime. If you don't mind explaining, I am trying to understand if I should be dry conching first. At this time I melt alot of cacao butter, and half that amount cacao liquor, and pour it into the cocoatown melanger, and then quickly add the powdered sugar. This I grind for up to 4 hrs before adding any other ingredients. Would I benefit in this case by dry conching, just letting the liquor grind by itself, or has this step already been done by the company who produces the liquor or paste I buy? (Or is this up to the producer?)
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Michael -
Macintyre manufactures universals of many sizes with the smallest being about 45kg as I remember. There are many makers of this style of machine. They are not just conches - they are grinders, refiners, and conches and you can get them in sizes up to many tonnes.
And yes - they are fast, which is one reason chocolate manufacturers like them.
Challenge is, many people stretch to buy a single ECGC65 so even a small universal from Macintyre - starting prices well over $20k - is too much for most people. There are machines from China that are much less expensive but they have bad reputations for reliability. I am working with a company out of South America to bring a 40kg universal to the US for well under $10k - probably not until September at the earliest.
The conche I was referring to in the last paragraph is not a universal. It's a new machine I helped shepherd through the design and manufacturing process with FBM. It's a 50kg melting tank with integrated pump with a conche attachment that fits over the bowl of the melter. When conching it has a capacity of about 35kg (you need head space in the top of the machine for air flow). You can pump in a lot of heat and air and generate a lot of shear force (through counter-rotating stirrers not grinding) and the pump moves the chocolate from the bottom of the bowl to the top the entire time.
It's really quite effective and it gives small chocolate makers a lot of control they don't have now over the flavor development process. It's not a grinder or a melangeur - it's a small, fast, conche that is also a melting tank so it has a lot of applications in the craft chocolate workshop.
It's name is Kleego and I will be making a formal announcement to ChocolateLife members - and the world - in the next couple of weeks.
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Clay - in regard to the conche you refer to at the end of your post, I have seen universal conches that look like a small Macintyre. I think Brad uses something like this. Is this what you are referring to? I had no idea that they were that much faster than a stone grinder.
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To really oversimplify things cocoa nib (what's left after roasting, cracking, and winnowing need to be:
a) Ground
b) Refined
c) Conched
on their way to becoming chocolate.
Nibs are ground into chocolate liquor and there are no other ingredients added. The result is a coarse, often gritty paste with a wide particle-size distribution with particles often in the 60-120 micron range, but this can vary widely.
The liquor then gets refined down to a point where the particle size distribution is in the 12-20 range. During refining other ingredients are added - sugar, milk, and vanilla. If you are using any form of crystalline sweetener you are going to need to refine it before conching.
Once the chocolate is refined, it is conched. Conching has both a physical component (improvement in texture) but also a flavor development component. There are two stages in conching. Dry (no added cocoa butter) and wet (after cocoa butter and/or lecithin are added).
A melanger (or melangeur) like a CocoaTown or Santha is technically being used as a "universal." Universals are called that because they handle all three stages - grinding, refining, and conching in a single device.
Devices like the CocoaTown were not developed for making chocolate originally. They were made for grinding soaked beans, such as lentils, into pastes. That's why they are called wet grinders. They look a lot like old-style melanguers and so they were adapted for that purpose.
You don't have to use the wet grinders as universals. You can pre-grind the nib and sugar to reduce the amount of time required to mix and refine them together in the wet grinder. Likewise, you can remove the chocolate from the wet grinder when it is refined and put it into a device that is designed specifically for conching.
The CocoaTowns and Santhas are used because they are relatively inexpensive (at least to get started) and relatively easier to understand and to use. They are not used because they are the best, or even good, ways to make chocolate. It is possible to get "real" universals of about the same capacity as a CocoaTown 65 for about the same price that will be able to go from nib to finished chocolate in under 24 hours.
It is (now) possible to buy a conche that will do in 2-4 hours what it takes a CocoaTown 65 48 hours or more to perform. The price is about 50% higher than a CocoaTown 65 for roughly the same capacity.
melanger necessary?
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yes, I am using dessicant cans to suck moisture out of the bucket of sugar and then I powder and grind the sugar into the rest.
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Hi Beth, I had also made chocolate using coconut sugar instead of table sugar. The humidity issues must be dealt with before the sugar comes in contact with the cocoa or the shelf life and finishing of the final product will be compromised. Are you facing this challenge?
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howdy, if by conching you mean grinding the sugar in and blending all ingredients then it takes around 3-4 hrs if all goes well. I am using coconut sugar and dealing with humidity issues which can make the sugar clump and slow the process alot. I am not sure if what I am doing is conching. I am not grinding the actual beans. I am also doing around 8 lb batches and using a cocoatown melanger. I am maxing it out and hope it won't hurt the machine over time. peace, Beth
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Beth and Clay,
If you don't mind sharing, what's your experience with conch times for batches? I am using a friend's machine at the moment and at doing about 8lb batches I am conching for about 3 hours. Just curious as to what others are doing. Any and all input appreciated.
Best
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thanks, i got a melanger from cocaotown and I'm very happy with the results. Much smoother than before.
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Beth:
You can certainly "reconstitute" cocoa powder and cocoa butter with sugar (and other ingredients) to make chocolate. You do not have to start from liquor or mass.
You will need something to mix the ingredients together, get the particle size down, make sure that any clumps of particles (called agglomerates) are broken up, and that the particles are completely covered in fat. Some flavor development may also be necessary.
I do know people who just melt the cocoa butter, mix in (by hand) the cocoa powder, and add a non-crystalline sweetener (e.g., agave syrup). In this case, they do not use a melangeur/conche.
However, if you are using a crystalline sugar (e.g., white, evaporated cane juice), then you will need a grinder to get the texture right.